"Models"

[kingrat]

A model poll and discussion on the crack bored.

I'll fess up. I'm one of the people who occasionally makes derisive comments about "models" in general.

First off, if derisive comments about what you do in general bother you, then I'll tell you the same thing that was just told to those who don't like model photos: "Don't read them." Get a thicker skin. Get over it. Ignore them. Are these people whose opinions you respect? If so, maybe they have a point that you should listen to. If not, who cares what they think? In any case, the world does not revolve around your self-esteem.

As a geek, I have learned to deal with all sorts of derisive comments over the years. I used to take them pretty personally. You know what though? I enjoy what I do, so fuck em. Let em make whatever comments they want. What I do is not for everyone, nor will everyone understand that. Gamers have learned to deal with it. You would think goths in general would learn to not be bothered with comments from outside their community that they are ugly, depressed, and obsessed.

---

So now I'll make my generic comments about "models." I respect a great deal those who are trying for something truly artistic. And those who are trying to make a living or at least add to their bank account. And those who want to have something of themselves that shows themselves off in a good light.

What I find amusing is the constant "look at me" aspect of it. And the incestuous nature of it, where it's the same people getting the same photographs done by the same photographers in the same style. It very much like a mutual appreciation society. It's not the photos themselves, which are often very nice looking (if a bit repetitive), but more the mindset. Then taking that humdrum thing and saying "look at me!" It feels like they attach way more importance and cachet to these photos than they actually merit.

It's very much the same attitude I have toward people who spend much time and effort dressing "different" just to hang out with similar people. YOU AREN'T DIFFERENT ANYMORE!

I would love to see more photos though. Make C-ko seem as intriguing in a photo as I see her in person. Bring out the real intensity of Raven. Yes, I know the squeaky wheel gets the photos. And the gothy bloody photos get a lot of rave reviews so lots of people like to do them. I know it's not your responsibility to appeal to my desires. By the same token, I don't have to like all the stuff I see and I certainly am not going to refrain from making my views known on occasion. Just as you don't have to like my comments or opinions and should feel free to rebut them, make fun of them, make fun of me as repressed, or whatever.

If I didn't make my thoughts known, I would be guilty of a form of self-censoring political correctness. I won't ask you to stop making a stink about my opinions though. Cause that would be just as self-censoring. Make whatever stink you want.

Comments

[ex-maxmin919.livejournal.com]

Personally, I would have no problem with you critiquing my pics. I find most 'gee, those are great pics' to be not at all helpful, and I often suspect that some people are complimenting my choice of a model more than the pics themselves. I admit that most of my stuff has been with one model, but seeing as how she's my girlfriend, that's not too surprising. I tried to do something a bit different with these ones (http://students.washington.edu/maxmin/pics/PicsBymaxMIN/Forest/), but they're still a lot more 'modelly' than I want.

Regarding criticism of goths in general, I tend to laugh at it myself.

[aaminahlefae.livejournal.com]

I used to model professionally for a few years -years back now. My frank and ruthless 2 cents on it is that if you take offense to something said about photos of yourself then you're obviously not a real professional model. Being a model means being cattle in fashionable clothes and backgrounds -glorified coat hangers was a term my first agent used -accurately. You have to have a thick skin because prospective clients don't look at you as a person but as a possibility to make their products look good, that's the whole point of the industry, and if you become friends with them or they treat you nice, that's a perk, but not a typical trait therein. Fake niceness runs rampant, sure. Networking makes money. Our crowd, having a lot of creatives and a saturated photography market creates many opportunities for non or sparcely working models and photographers to get together and make some yummy stuff. -Thus all the 'look at me's. I agree the importance to merit ratio is off. I, for one, do shoots kind of oftenish (as one might guess from the avatars -I need to rotate some too) but I don't pipe up about it because it's not a big deal. Gee; I'm kind of glad I haven't had time to check the crackboard much lately. ;-p

hmmmm

[euterpe35.livejournal.com]

Very fairly said, I think.

I still like to look at all the purty pichers, though.

Guess I'm unsophisticated, I don't really think about that it's "always the same models"
or whatever. I just like them.

Same way I either give movies a thumbs up or a thumbs down.... because elaborating on why I like or don't like something isn't what I do very well.

[grace-batmonkey.livejournal.com]

"I know it's not your responsibility to appeal to my desires."

Love that line.

And, to a degree, agree with you. At least as far as the same ol'- same ol' aspect, anyway.

I really love the idea about going after those subjects that folks would normally overlook as models or not try to capture the intensity/image value of. We've had freeform shoots before, and maybe it's time for another one. They are generally all about getting people on film that don't usually end up there.

Lastly, absolutely concur that if someone puts something up, they should expect whatever opinions come up. Good or bad. As long as it's not someone mocking the entire effort with nothing constructive to contribute, or someone wandering in a saying, "yawn"...those are my limits, though. I do get a little peeved when folks decide to incorporate themselves into a discussion just to be contrary or to throw a spanner in the works. But if someone's promoting something, I feel that if I have the time and the ability to marshal my thoughts around their effort, they deserve my honest input. And I have the freedom to give it to them.

Um.
That got long. Sorry!

You like me! You really really like me!

[bork.livejournal.com]

I have toyed with having a modeling session done with photos, just because I want to see what they do with my 'Thom Yorke on Quaaludes' eyes and droopy dawg face.

[vorona.livejournal.com]

Yeah. As usual, I have about 3-5 contrasty opinions on this.
People should be tougher. On the other hand, they're
not, stuff hurts. Also, am I supposed to worry a lot about
the delicate egos of people who are constantly told they're
beautiful and sexy? Somehow I think they can cope well
enough. I know, I know. Dissing ANYONE isn't right... but
please. Beautiful models need to have a little grace about
their good fortune, and consider the feelings of those who
feel left out.

And YES, I would certainly like to see some artistic and
intuitive/expressive photos of some of our less-photographed
friends. I get a little tired of everything having to be
about vinyl, fancy hair, and bondage. I'd like to see more.

[c-dawg.livejournal.com]

Wow. I agree with you on so many levels.

I learned good and early that being on the internet required a thick skin. You put yourself out there - now expect to be dissected, critiqued, complimented, ignored, and be able to accept any of them with grace.

If you are attempting to "model", then you need to be prepared for feedback. I bemoan the "internet model" craze too, because I think it encourages the attribution of self-worth to appearance. The creativity I see in many of the photographs is being hauled by the "not very much" truck. Different outfit, different make-up, over and over and over again. Why? It's obviously not a creative outlet; otherwise, you would BE CREATIVE.

It was nice to meet you last night, even though we didn't really get to chat. I'm looking forward to next weekend.